A correspondent, Konstantin Kisin, recently posted this:
I went to the “Unite the Kingdom” rally to film interviews with people on the ground as well as Tommy and other speakers backstage. I have been to pro-Palestine, pro-Israel, climate protests etc so have a good sense of the rally in context of other events.
You can watch the full movie below but here are some additional thoughts:
The police estimate for attendance (110,000) seems like a massive undercount and organiser claim of “millions” is an exaggeration. I would guess 400-600k.
The “Unite the Kingdom” rally in London on Saturday, the 13th of September, was led by a man named Tommy Robinson. It, together with rallies and marches in Korea (South, of course), and elsewhere, was primarily oriented towards free speech rights and restrictions on immigration (and the impacts on societies of virtually unlimited immigration).
Konstantin continues in his article to describe his own experience in London as “a well known immigrant” and how what he saw made liars out of the mainstream media and politicians’ claims about the march and rally.
Only three days after the murder of Charlie Kirk, the London protest also joined the many other gatherings, around the world, mourning Kirk’s death and supporting his stands on political and religious matters.
A quick Google search will find all the claims of the media: that the protest was “far right” and “anti-migrant” while the numbers present are low-balled. On the other hand, you will find a few media voices that exaggerate numbers: consider the Deseret News’ article. Konstantin has no reason to either exaggerate or minimize the numbers he saw. But he points out many things that put the lie to the media accusations.
It is not hate of immigrants – nor even of the idea of migration – that is motivating protests like these. Nor is their effort to fight for the right to use “hate speech.” It is not neo-Nazi or fascist ideas that they are pushing. Rather, they are pushing back against government and the worshippers of government.
As one protestor in London said, “… we are not here because we hate. We are not here because we want bad things for other people. We are here because we grew up knowing freedoms, and we will get those freedoms back for our kids and our grandchildren.” The organizer himself is an enemy of the state who has spent time in jail for exercising his God-given right to free speech in a crowd. He seems to share this goals not the goal of fascists or corporists or Tranzis.
They want to free, not enslave.
We think that is an admirable goal. And a goal that can be reached. But 400,000 people gathering for an afternoon in London, or even a million for a whole day, is not going to accomplish that. Any more than having christians faithfully assemble in their meetinghouses each week to “worship” God and preach and sing to one another is going to “win the world for Christ.”
\At best, just as those Sunday assemblies are to encourage, edify, and educate those believers helping them to go out and teach, one on one and to a few at a time. To inform and persuade others of the message they are teaching. It is no different in England.
Or in any of the States. Rallying to carry wreaths and signs and together go down on their knees to pray – and saying nice things about Charlie and his family – is an encouragement. A statement. But not going to change society or the situation we face today.
What will?
Going to and talking with those whom we see as enemies or supporting our enemies. Political, religious, social, and moral enemies. Arguing with them, which includes listening to them and answering their questions and accepting the challenge to explain what and why. And not giving up with a single talk or argument. Or even rejection: going back again and again to challenge what they believe, what they do, what they want.
And treating them with love, with patience, with understanding. Even when we have to protect ourselves and ours from their anger, their reactions, and their words and deeds. It is not enough to pray for and work for these social justice warriors to change their ideas and attitudes. We must also be prepared to, and willing to, defend ourselves and our loved ones and our communities from these people who are not and will not be convinced.
How do we do that? We expose them for what they are. Not just their TicToc and Facebook posts, not just the rants on the news clips and media front pages. Not just the rants and signs of their protests and marches. But in the schools, the universities, the businesses, and the entertainment venues. Challenging them, demanding that they prove their claims, tone down their language – not by force, but by persuasion. And listening then answering them with truth, honestly and sincerely. And kindly.
This seems to be what Charlie Kirk was doing. This seems to be what Tommy Robinson is trying to do. And a thousand more. Not always perfectly, or even effectively. But it can be done. And as several have pointed out, those methods work: the fact that one madman (as known to several other like-minded people) resorted to violence to silence such a voice reveals that is an effective way to destroy enemies. Not to kill them, not to imprison them, but to win them to good. Good thoughts, good actions, and a lot of patience. Or to use an older word, “longsuffering.”
If liberty is worth standing up for, it is worth paying the price demanded.
About TPOL Nathan
Follower of Christ Jesus (a christian), Pahasapan (resident of the Black Hills), Westerner, Lover of Liberty, Free-Market Anarchist, Engineer, Army Officer, Husband, Father, Historian, Writer, Evangelist. Successor to Lady Susan (Mama Liberty) at TPOL.
The Price of Liberty 
British brothers find themselves in peaceful protests – that will most likely prove useless
A correspondent, Konstantin Kisin, recently posted this:
I went to the “Unite the Kingdom” rally to film interviews with people on the ground as well as Tommy and other speakers backstage. I have been to pro-Palestine, pro-Israel, climate protests etc so have a good sense of the rally in context of other events.
You can watch the full movie below but here are some additional thoughts:
The police estimate for attendance (110,000) seems like a massive undercount and organiser claim of “millions” is an exaggeration. I would guess 400-600k.
The “Unite the Kingdom” rally in London on Saturday, the 13th of September, was led by a man named Tommy Robinson. It, together with rallies and marches in Korea (South, of course), and elsewhere, was primarily oriented towards free speech rights and restrictions on immigration (and the impacts on societies of virtually unlimited immigration).
Konstantin continues in his article to describe his own experience in London as “a well known immigrant” and how what he saw made liars out of the mainstream media and politicians’ claims about the march and rally.
Only three days after the murder of Charlie Kirk, the London protest also joined the many other gatherings, around the world, mourning Kirk’s death and supporting his stands on political and religious matters.
A quick Google search will find all the claims of the media: that the protest was “far right” and “anti-migrant” while the numbers present are low-balled. On the other hand, you will find a few media voices that exaggerate numbers: consider the Deseret News’ article. Konstantin has no reason to either exaggerate or minimize the numbers he saw. But he points out many things that put the lie to the media accusations.
It is not hate of immigrants – nor even of the idea of migration – that is motivating protests like these. Nor is their effort to fight for the right to use “hate speech.” It is not neo-Nazi or fascist ideas that they are pushing. Rather, they are pushing back against government and the worshippers of government.
As one protestor in London said, “… we are not here because we hate. We are not here because we want bad things for other people. We are here because we grew up knowing freedoms, and we will get those freedoms back for our kids and our grandchildren.” The organizer himself is an enemy of the state who has spent time in jail for exercising his God-given right to free speech in a crowd. He seems to share this goals not the goal of fascists or corporists or Tranzis.
They want to free, not enslave.
We think that is an admirable goal. And a goal that can be reached. But 400,000 people gathering for an afternoon in London, or even a million for a whole day, is not going to accomplish that. Any more than having christians faithfully assemble in their meetinghouses each week to “worship” God and preach and sing to one another is going to “win the world for Christ.”
\At best, just as those Sunday assemblies are to encourage, edify, and educate those believers helping them to go out and teach, one on one and to a few at a time. To inform and persuade others of the message they are teaching. It is no different in England.
Or in any of the States. Rallying to carry wreaths and signs and together go down on their knees to pray – and saying nice things about Charlie and his family – is an encouragement. A statement. But not going to change society or the situation we face today.
What will?
Going to and talking with those whom we see as enemies or supporting our enemies. Political, religious, social, and moral enemies. Arguing with them, which includes listening to them and answering their questions and accepting the challenge to explain what and why. And not giving up with a single talk or argument. Or even rejection: going back again and again to challenge what they believe, what they do, what they want.
And treating them with love, with patience, with understanding. Even when we have to protect ourselves and ours from their anger, their reactions, and their words and deeds. It is not enough to pray for and work for these social justice warriors to change their ideas and attitudes. We must also be prepared to, and willing to, defend ourselves and our loved ones and our communities from these people who are not and will not be convinced.
How do we do that? We expose them for what they are. Not just their TicToc and Facebook posts, not just the rants on the news clips and media front pages. Not just the rants and signs of their protests and marches. But in the schools, the universities, the businesses, and the entertainment venues. Challenging them, demanding that they prove their claims, tone down their language – not by force, but by persuasion. And listening then answering them with truth, honestly and sincerely. And kindly.
This seems to be what Charlie Kirk was doing. This seems to be what Tommy Robinson is trying to do. And a thousand more. Not always perfectly, or even effectively. But it can be done. And as several have pointed out, those methods work: the fact that one madman (as known to several other like-minded people) resorted to violence to silence such a voice reveals that is an effective way to destroy enemies. Not to kill them, not to imprison them, but to win them to good. Good thoughts, good actions, and a lot of patience. Or to use an older word, “longsuffering.”
If liberty is worth standing up for, it is worth paying the price demanded.
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About TPOL Nathan
Follower of Christ Jesus (a christian), Pahasapan (resident of the Black Hills), Westerner, Lover of Liberty, Free-Market Anarchist, Engineer, Army Officer, Husband, Father, Historian, Writer, Evangelist. Successor to Lady Susan (Mama Liberty) at TPOL.